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Transcript by DC
Jan Cox Talk # 2540 - June 19, 2000
Copyright Jan cox, Jan's Legacy, 2008
These notes prepared by DC on 1/20/2008 from audio file.
Suggested title: The Boogaloo is Doing You
NOTE: there is a long pause at minute 27
00:01 You people out there on tape, I thought I would tell you -- I'm sure you'll be able to hear the difference tonight -- that everyone who's here is standing up on the stage and I'm sitting out in the middle of the audience in a chair talking.
00:18 As strange, as curious as the few people struggling with This sort of thing, the subset of the general set of humanity, as strange as that is, you know there's something stranger. Maybe several things...it just periodically strikes me that here I stand...talking to a small number of people and there's a sizable number of people all around the world, right now, and I know what it is they're looking for, and all I'm talking to is you people.
01:01 It turns out -- I keep forgetting -- but a lot of them know that I'm here; nobody shows up. I think starting that web page was the final cure. That they're all just going to stay where they are...maybe that should give me some hope: if it turns out that people would prefer not to be around me personally...
01:50 I wrote some stuff. You want me to read it? "Yeah!" OK.
01:53 [Reads] A sage asked a monk, "Do you find your mind to be in a satisfactory condition?" "No," replied the novice, "it is for that very reason that I seek enlightenment." And the sage seemed to ponder these words then said to the monk, "But is it not the mind that you employ in your search?" And the monk nodded his agreement. "So tell me, how do you intend to use a thing that you have already determined is in an unsatisfactory condition to take you to a satisfactory condition?" And the neophyte muttered, "I was hoping you wouldn't ask that."
02:36 The fact is, no one wants to be asked that. It cuts into their endless speculation time. See? You people forgot that already. That was a news item from last week. Remember the guy who was addressing an audience and said, "Do I take it that all you people are here because you're interested in finding your true self?"..."Do you want me to tell you directly, or..."
03:24 How can that which is salty ever produce that which is sweet? Or that which is vacillating ever produce that which is certain? Or that which is fragmented ever produce that which is whole?
03:40 From one view there are but three types of talk: talk that conveys information about the physical world; talk that tells others how you feel; and all other talk being merely to pass the time, talk for its own sake.
04:00 You will never get to the bottom of things if you believe there are any exceptions to this, such as talk about -- oh -- getting to the bottom of things.
04:14 Being asleep verbally is wherein your words have no corresponding reality based on your own experiences. And, you're not aware of it.
04:26 Question: What is the difference between a good rock band and a great mystical lecture? A great rock band makes you want to dance.
04:40 If by being thoughtful all men are fools, then two types of fools are not fools: Fools that know that thinking man is a fool, and clear-headed fools doing the Boog-A-Loo. Dancing with no thought of dancing is real experience. Dancing that's done partially in the mind is a dream experience which can become one of the distorted memories that make up the world of sleep.
05:15 One man who oversees his own private zoo says he pictures the ideal situation thus: "The silent wisdom of the elephant combined with an otter's attitude toward life."
05:34 No routinely healthy person thinks that their liver, lungs or kidneys are "out of control"...and yet a few, the mystics, think so about part of their brain. They think that their mind is out of control and think that by achieving enlightenment they will rectify the condition. Or perhaps it is vice versa.
It's still the same.
06:11 Just be still for a moment and consider the entire affair. A man, in his mind, thinks that his mind is out of his control. [Repeats] This is getting dangerously close to something else, but I think I'll leave it. I'll tell you what it's close to -- maybe I'll save it for another night -- all this idea about 'living in a dream'...it's just a smoke screen; it's not true. But if there were distortions, if there were dreams, then there is one big dream. I'll put it to you better: there is only one dream...and no one ever talks about it, even mystics. I'll give you until next time...
07:48 Back to the reading. Be still for a moment....A man, in his mind, thinks that his mind is out of his control. Consider that. Now, without a doubt, we all know that such can seem to be so, but just ponder the whole notion and let its inherent -- what shall we call it? -- foolishness...sneak up on you and give you a good, liberating shake back to physical reality...you use your mind and you consider the fact that "My mind is out of my control."...
09:14 What standard outside of itself does the mind have by which to make any judgements of itself?...
09:44 For those who have adopted the idea that man is asleep and wish some way to gauge same, here it is: To the degree that you live in your head, to that same degree you're asleep. The body knows nothing of dream world.
10:05 It can be useful at times to adopt this view: that you have two minds, one of which has thoughts and another which supplies the mind with thoughts.
10:20 One day one man suddenly thought, "If my mind didn't believe that it is in charge I wouldn't be asleep." And after letting this sink in for a moment he was further struck, "Wait! It's even better than that. I wouldn't be asleep if my mind just didn't believe that it was in charge of itself."
10:45 Before you become clear headed there is available to you Zen, yoga, Sufism and such, so that you can have something else to think about when you don't want to think about what you usually think about.
Same as listening to me.
11:06 Some have said that enlightenment always succeeds philosophy about it while others have said there is enlightenment without a prior philosophy, although no one can explain or describe such a thing. I feel that I flummoxed that one in my writing. Some people believe...that enlightenment can only come about after thought, much thought...while some others have said...that you can have enlightenment without any prior thought about it, although no one can say how such a thing could happen...consider, how could that be? Why would it be that no one can adequately describe it?...Even those who say it can happen can't describe or explain it. And you can't either. But if you push it to the point of describing why you can't, you're enlightened. Or, you're not unenlightened.
13:15 One man said, "Soon after I became involved in This kind of activity, I stopped thinking in terms of my 'being asleep' but rather called the condition 'talking to myself.' Then after a surprisingly long period of time it finally hit me that talking to myself isn't the real problem; listening to myself is. You do yourselves a favor -- until I see that more people get that I'm going to keep repackaging it...
13:55 One man said, "What I like about drinking and drugging is that it's like I have willfully stepped into a blinding rainstorm whereas in my normal mental state it's like I wander around in a nebulous fog, a condition not of my choosing." Someone asked him why he thought this observation belonged in a collection of items related to the great struggle for enlightenment and the guy just walked away.
14:29 It is possible that a man who tells you what's going on knows what's going on. But what's actually going on could never be exactly what he tells you is going on. Well, for one reason, part of what's now going on is his telling you what's going on. Tricky. Not mysterious, just tricky.
15:03 I can't resist bringing this one up again...[novice mechanic, doctor/patient]...when it reaches the point that they can't diagnose what's going on then it is very likely that they will turn on the patient or the driver of the car...and what they're saying is, "...I don't really know what these symptoms mean; I can't find what's wrong"....I ask you to consider how that relates to a man believing that he is in a condition that should be changed...
18:47 A man trying to awaken, "What's wrong with me? Why can't I do better?"...It amounts to this: How can...a person believe that they're going to use something, that is, the mind to cure the mind? You're going to take something about which you're already uncertain, is composed of uncertainties, fragments...how do men believe, even mystics that by some sort of hocus-pocus, some kind of extra-systemic Three-card Monte, that you're going to shift around all of these ideas...in what way are you going to keep shuffling them around...and someday that which is incomplete is going to produce that which is complete?...Listening to me?
20:55 [Adam's grandson] "Being asleep is believing that somebody else is not."
21:51 I'm going to read it to you again...Let's SAY that someone who tells you what's going on knows what's going on...obviously, anybody who tells you what's wrong with life, they know even less than nothing. Their ass is not even up to the starting line...anyone who tells you what's going on, that is sure proof they don't know...me telling you what's going on is now part of what's going on...
23:11 It is possible...that someone who tells you what's going on actually knows what's going on. BUT what's going on cannot be exactly, precisely what's going on even if they tell you they know. Because now what's going on is involved partly with them telling you...
24:00 Back to, as always, inside of one man's head. Don't you realize that's what you're doing when you diagnose what's wrong with you?...You're telling you what Life's about.
25:02 Try it one more way, just for a moment: Telling yourself at any moment that "I am asleep"...do you understand that that is part of your proper state at that moment?...There's only one, big delusion...ignorance...and no one, including mystics, ever think about it...
26:43 Headline: Cleverness Amidst All of This. (How opportune.) While trying to get a grip on all of this a man tends to be too clever by half. And once he does have it in hand he is then too clever to try to be clever.
27:46 [After pause on tape] I'm thinking; I'm thinking.
27:54 For you people on audio, I'm thinking. That is, I've read all the papers and now I'm thinking.
28:15 I'm still thinking.
28:19 You know what I was thinking about? Standing here saying that I was thinking and nothing else.
28:35 I don't know how anyone could believe that they're interested in such as this unless they think about it just about all the time. And I don't know how anyone can spend their whole life...thinking about this...without ever realizing what's going on.
29:02 If you could think about this all the time would that not be the same as having everything that you want?...What if you never thought about it again; would that not be the same thing?
29:30 What if you quit trying to diagnose yourself?...What if being awake is to understand the folly of diagnosing yourself?
30:45 How can the mind diagnose itself?...What does it have as a standard by which to diagnose anything? In case any of you ever wondered, why are there such things as writing and books, what standard do people have to judge their mind?
31:40 [Ordinary religious people] are closer to the reality of it than mystics are...that is, their attitude about what's wrong with them is based on behavior, that which is observable...they're actually closer to it than mystics...who believe that what the problem is, is...partly mental...
32:05 Back to the question...what standard, what, outside of the mind, does anyone's mind have to use as a standard?
32:55 What would ordinary people answer?...the results of other people's minds....that is at the very heart of an extra-systemic force giving man messages...that's what most of the planet would resort to finally....a humanist...would [cite] scientific discoveries...and from their view that is just as far removed from divine revelation as it can be...
36:00 And it's the same thing: it's the world of the mind.
36:09 All of you are just asking for continued trouble if you don't have a clear view of that by now, the kind of view that is a pretty much constant awareness on your part. Or else the Secondary world, the world of the mind, will always bamboozle you....[not] just by religion...or by psychoanalysis...you're being bamboozled by your mind. [Freud, Abraham] --talk about magic...dead and gone 3,000 years and you sit there and read them and they still bamboozle you.
37:13 That's just the minimum...I repeat the question: What, outside of a man's mind, does he have by which to judge the mind? And the answer is, "Nothing!" And you've got to be awake to see that. You've got to be enlightened. You've got to have a grip.
37:51 I look at some of your faces sitting here at night and I wonder...people may hear this, civilians, later on. It's just a kind of challenge...It took me most of my life to ever get a glimpse of that.
38:34 You can't know what's going on. It's not possible to know what's going on...because to "know what's going on" -- see, that's the trick: you can see what's going on, but nobody knows what's going on. And when you see what's going on, you no longer know what's going on. That is, the only people that know what's going on are the people who don't know what's going on. It's not just silly; it's just a blunt fact...because when you realize what's going on, you can't know what's going on...and it's not just to look out there and realize what's going on because you're part of out there and your mind's the only thing doing this...
39:41 From one real perspective that is the cutting point of whether you really catch on to what This is or not. As much as you may enjoy...but to ever grasp this simple fact, to even hear this question...[frog gods, tree gods]...
42:44 The mind has nothing outside itself by which to judge itself...one of Adam's close grandchildren...somebody surely saw it in that same light. So, that should have been the beginning of the end of all mystical systems, that one question. Well, you'd have to have a couple of questions. You'd say, "Are you satisfied with the way your mind works?"...."This is everything I have to tell you. I've spent my life doing this..."Ask yourself this question..."...It's far too simple and it's far too blunt...
44:28 But that is it. The rest of it is just killing time. You're just reading magazines in the doctor's office...
44:50 How do you know your asleep? See? Nobody even wants to deal with that....
46:10 The more I talk about it, not only am I astounded that anybody ever gets this, I get so astounded sometimes when I'm talking about it to you people I think,"Well, god, I'm not only astounded that some people in the past, that anybody...I'm astounded if one other person ever realized this."...What's really astounding is that I did....it gets worse though...I go, "Wait a minute. What did I have to judge being astounded?"...I've got no way to tell that that's astonishing...Well, yeah, I do, but I can't tell you what it is.
47:02 If you ponder that question the thing is, if you don't find a way out, if you really took it to heart, so to speak, you would sit around and drive yourself crazy...what are those donuts, twisters?...It's also sort of surprising that that doesn't give a bigger hint. Of course, it's easy to say once you get past it. It wasn't easy to say when you're in the midst of it. Because you think, "Well, I'm missing something."
48:24 You've listened to somebody who you assume knows something about it..."And it just goes round and round in my head, back and forth..." Hint, hint. Psst. Psst...."Don't give me that shit; I want an answer!" I gave you the answer: that question. That's the answer.
49:12 The point is, no matter what you say about your mental condition...that operation of the brain that we call the mind...no matter what it is that you're thinking about yourself or no matter what it is that you think that I'm saying...ask yourself what does your mind...have outside of itself...by which to judge anything about itself? To make any comment, like "Well, yes, I shouldn't be thinking like this." Based on what?
50:40 If you think that there is any answer to that, you are asleep.
50:59 I'm not trying to encourage migraines.
51:04 For awhile I wondered if that's what dogs were doing...why dogs would just get up, just for no reason, and turn around a couple of times and lay back down right where they were. And for awhile I thought..."Wait a minute. That's some way they're trying to expel that kind of energy." In fact, I tried it for awhile. Rather than just sit there and get confused, I'd get up and just turn around several times...I thought maybe having a tail was involved...[hilarious] maybe [when working on this question] you should be laying on the floor...you may think that can't do any good, but I'll tell you this: as much good as thinking about all of this.
52:38 ...bittersweet fun...a certain tartness. Just keep asking yourself that question though.
53:00 And then Wednesday, I'm going to tell you what I promised. I'm going to tell you the one thing. It's the only real delusion. It's the only real ignorance. It's the only real dream. All these other things are just little echoes of dreams....There's only one and nobody ever talks about it...every now and then people have tried to talk about it...
54:00 Stay tuned if you have a tuner.